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15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

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Subject: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 15 Jun 2015, 11:59

Map Title: The Altar of the Sun
Author: EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)
From: Legacy
Filename: Legacy-11.unr
Music Files: Enigma.umx, SETI.umx




Video Playthrough:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcvPQquHewg

Synopsis: From Kalladrad Halls, you've reached the Altar of the Sun. Try to find a way to get back to the Nexus!

Discuss!

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 17 Jun 2015, 22:41

Unfortunately I never got to finish Legacy, and not because I didn't want to, on the contrary; up until where I got stuck it was really refreshing and fun.
Unfortunately, the video playthrough doesn't give me that same feeling: that gun especially seems like a pain in the *ss to use, those sticky bombs however are cool.

BTW is it in Legacy that there's a ripper whith blades that cuts the adversary 4 or 5 times before coming back to the weapon?

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 17 Jun 2015, 23:44

I guess my old comment still applies here:

It doesn't have much wrong with it and yet it's probably a contender for the least memorable map in Legacy. I can't really call it conceptually lacking, because the inferred concept of a Temple to the Sun on a rocky spire is cool, and there's some interesting geometry and a unique theme. Something about it fails to come together though. It's probably to do with the gameplay implementation; other levels in Legacy have some sort of heavy puzzle focus or other twist/gimmick to them, yet this is just a straightforward walk to the exit with a few lava bridges to cross and a boss fight (the boss fight is a nice demonstration of the oddity of Legacy's design, as it's pretty much fodder despite how unwieldy Legacy's weapons can feel in standard battles), along with very little storytelling. It ends up feeling like some sort of diversion as opposed to how the other levels feel like part of a journey.
Formerly Mman

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 19 Jun 2015, 00:45

God I hate the ant people.

But I like this one. It's a bit strange, yes. Very Gonzo on the design. But hey, that's our boy EzKeel.

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 19 Jun 2015, 01:01

ImageImage

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 19 Jun 2015, 02:02

UBerserker wrote:http://www.unrealsp.org/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=776


Holy shit, UB! :o

salsaSkaarj wrote:BTW is it in Legacy that there's a ripper whith blades that cuts the adversary 4 or 5 times before coming back to the weapon?


You're talking about the razor disk! :wink: and it actually is the entire weapon, so it just comes back to the player's hands - like a boomerang.

Semfry wrote:I can't really call it conceptually lacking, because the inferred concept of a Temple to the Sun on a rocky spire is cool, and there's some interesting geometry and a unique theme.


Mister_Prophet wrote:I like this one. It's a bit strange, yes. Very Gonzo on the design. But hey, that's our boy EzKeel.


You guys said in little words what makes me love Legacy as a whole. I haven't had a chance to comment on a level from this pack before, so I'm going to elaborate on my feelings about EZKeel's work a little bit:-

It may just be that, when I got around to playing UT again about two years ago (and Unreal by extension) and discovered the game's modding community, Legacy was the first large campaign I played (after going through a number of single player maps, and a few short campaigns as well, including some really excellent stuff like the new Shamuquest series). It may just be that I'm also a bit bizarre, at the end of the day! But this pack managed to capture my imagination. It really felt unique, personal (combination of visuals, music, atmosphere), the story was strong, and there were some brilliant moments of gameplay. And all the shortcomings which some of you are better than me at pointing out (by virtue of having spent more time on games than I), simply failed to register at any significant level during my playthrough (with the exception of the Christian themed intrusions). It was just a great experience for me. And a great finale, too!!
I know an objective assessment would show some blatant weaknesses in this work, but the way I enjoyed Legacy is such that I don't prefer Nali Chronicles or the professional Xidia Gold to this. First impressions count, too, so maybe it's just that I gave Legacy a chance first (based on the general approach of playing from the lowest to the highest rated mods), and then the next mods had to be better in order to impress as much, but goddammit, there's a soul to Legacy.
The Altar of the Sun is great in that wonderfully weird, unique way. Pretty short map, but I remember it still had enough challenge to it (thanks to that early miniboss) for me to rank its difficulty as average. Just one thing struck me as, perhaps, derivative (in this particular map): some of the areas outside, especially when the central monument isn't in view and you're between big brown walls on perfectly flat terrain, managed to make me think of Doom! :P
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Waffnuffly wrote:It's tarydium-doped smoothies. Drunk by the player, I mean. The player is tripping balls. The whole game actually takes place in a large city and the player thinks he's on an alien world.

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 19 Jun 2015, 02:42

Fun is fun. Anyone who written a review for the site has to do the score thing, because that's the schema. I reviewed the most recent review of this one (Years ago, I might add. God I wish you folks would commit more 2nd opinion reviews!) and I still agree with the sentiments I've made about it. I like most of the levels I play from the community and always have affection for anyone who tries to make levels for this game. I have said on multiple occasions that I've liked levels that the numerical score I've given would indicate otherwise (but if you want worse, flip through a gaming mag. Jeee-Zus. Even the garbage gets a score or 7 or 8. Or 9.75)

I feel this way about EZkeel's maps in general; they always get nitpicked by the Technical Teddy's, since way back when (the Leet Mappers were hardly kind to him, but in the end his maps stood the test of time) but if I wrote the same review for a site that's schema was a Thumbs Up or a Thumps Down, this would be a :tup: and that would be that. This level is a pretty good barometer for the merits of the pack. The high points are the bits that are just flat out adverse to Unreal's style. It's just hard to do that with Unreal SP, making people forget what game they are playing for a moment. Some of the most memorable levels made for and by the community are the ones that can pull that kinda thing off.

Watching the vid, some flashbacks to things I still like about this level and things I still don't

Likes

-EZkeel lights the way EZkeel wants to light. Deal with it.
-Love the red and brown colors in here.
-Like some of the texture choices, I can never tell if some walls are custom or classic
-I enjoy the outside bit quite a bit, still stands out in my memory.

Dislikes

-The shotgun reload sound is in your face, a lot in the vid. Not in a good way.
-I still hate the Ant People.

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 19 Jun 2015, 10:27

Sat42 wrote:You're talking about the razor disk! :wink: and it actually is the entire weapon, so it just comes back to the player's hands - like a boomerang.

Ah, so it is in Legacy. Another reason to reinstall UT (which I've been postponing too long now) and Legacy will be the first map(pack) to replay.

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 19 Jun 2015, 13:50

salsaSkaarj wrote:
Sat42 wrote:You're talking about the razor disk! :wink: and it actually is the entire weapon, so it just comes back to the player's hands - like a boomerang.

Ah, so it is in Legacy. Another reason to reinstall UT (which I've been postponing too long now) and Legacy will be the first map(pack) to replay.


You said you got stuck last time: just in case that was due to a bug, I'd say make sure to use at least two save slots in parallel, because when I played Legacy I noticed some saves get randomly corrupted (I'd try saving on a given slot - with no indication that something is wrong - and upon reloading the game, it'd take me back to the slot's previous saved state). Whenever you are about to leave The Nexus, save in one slot, and then when you're in the other level use a different slot; upon returning to The Nexus, you might want to immediately save in again a different slot (this could help if a bug occurs when you try to interact with one of the Nali huts for trade - you just reload and try again). Oh, and when in the Nexus, avoid approaching the blast door guarded by a Skaarj at the entrance to Triaxia unless you really want to go to Triaxia, because it only opens once and then it closes forever, even subsequent visits of the Nexus will not trigger the door anymore.

Mister_Prophet wrote:If you want worse, flip through a gaming mag. Jeee-Zus. Even the garbage gets a score or 7 or 8. Or 9.75


Hehe, yeah, makes the schema pretty meaningless. I also tend to roll my eyes at how some people consider a 60% to be a bad rating (some even say that for 70%), when damn, it's above 50% so it's more good than bad! Average is average (roughly 50-55%), quite good is quite good (60-65%), good is frankly good (70-75%), very good is very good (80-85%) and excellent is excellent (>90%). And 40% is not supposed to mean garbage yet. It's like some people don't use the full spectrum of their schema. Reminds me of a journalist who became quite famous for being very critical of Deus Ex (one of my favourite games of all time) and giving it a 5, which he had beforehand checked with the mag he worked for that this score did in fact mean average, not supposedly bad which would mean the schema could only be used from 7 to 10. In the end his review wasn't accepted because deemed too radical :P but again while very critical he didn't consider a 5 to translate as "bad", just average. Which in the context of that kind of schema, is what one is meant to understand.
OK and in the context of our community, I do appreciate the fact that there is a difference between a cold-hearted, technical score and the actual enjoyment, or evocative power a map or mappack can provide.

Mister_Prophet wrote:This level is a pretty good barometer for the merits of the pack. The high points are the bits that are just flat out adverse to Unreal's style. It's just hard to do that with Unreal SP, making people forget what game they are playing for a moment. Some of the most memorable levels made for and by the community are the ones that can pull that kinda thing off.


Indeed! :)
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Waffnuffly wrote:It's tarydium-doped smoothies. Drunk by the player, I mean. The player is tripping balls. The whole game actually takes place in a large city and the player thinks he's on an alien world.

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 19 Jun 2015, 14:32

Sat42 wrote:Oh, and when in the Nexus, avoid approaching the blast door guarded by a Skaarj at the entrance to Triaxia unless you really want to go to Triaxia, because it only opens once and then it closes forever, even subsequent visits of the Nexus will not trigger the door anymore.

Yes, that was my semi-permanent halt. thx for the info

As for the scores: I've mentioned this countless times - for me what counts is the gameplay (awe and balance) and the conceptual grandness, both of which are somewhat personal opnion. Yes, techninal execution, story construction etc... can up or down the general feeling of happiness with a map but as long as the map isn't totally illogical or contains major technical flaws - it goes into the vault named "Keepers".
BTW this is all going a bit off-topic (my fault for starting it). Perhaps a moderator could split this section into the general gameplay area?

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 20 Jun 2015, 00:18

I've always seen the schema proposed by Mike to be a collaboration of aspects that make the enjoyment of the level. For instance, gameplay on its own can be fantastic...but if a map has bugs or other issues that prevent the gameplay from happening then the gameplay has a problem. Look at it another way, how good is gameplay when the consideration of the game world fails to meet its standard?

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 20 Jun 2015, 11:53

Mister_Prophet wrote:I've always seen the schema proposed by Mike to be a collaboration of aspects that make the enjoyment of the level. For instance, gameplay on its own can be fantastic...but if a map has bugs or other issues that prevent the gameplay from happening then the gameplay has a problem. Look at it another way, how good is gameplay when the consideration of the game world fails to meet its standard?

You're basically confirming what I stated: technical execution (lack of that is) can block gameplay (e.g. a non-functioning trigger) and then becomes a gamekiller. However, a texture misalignment is more of an esthetical issue and doesn't interfere with gameplay.

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 20 Jun 2015, 12:48

What I'll also add is that gameplay can be fun even if the game world fails to meet its standard: look at Unreal Zero: Cats 2! Mind you, it's not anything I'd really enjoy, but some people will just derive their enjoyment from the crazy gameplay and not the environments which "have no soul or presence" (as you said in your review, Prophet). Of course in this case the environment doesn't interfere with the gameplay, so maybe I'm just repeating what's already been said, essentially.
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Waffnuffly wrote:It's tarydium-doped smoothies. Drunk by the player, I mean. The player is tripping balls. The whole game actually takes place in a large city and the player thinks he's on an alien world.

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Subject: Re: 15/06/2015 - "The Altar of the Sun" by EZkeel (Simon West-Bulford)

Post Posted: 20 Jun 2015, 16:14

Every reviewer is gonna have their lynchpin perspective also,

For me immersion is my swing vote. Anything that makes me aware that I'm playing a game spoils the good intentions. A tex misalignment here, a bad HOM there. I'd say this about movies too. Remember when Nick Cage yelled at a guy covered in cgi fire in Knowing? I remember, Nick.


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