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The UNBIBLE

For gameplay advice and broader discussion of single-player Unreal including custom maps, mods and mutations that alter the game.

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User avatar Hellscrag
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 21 Dec 2011, 18:19

Everything new that leaks out seems to broaden, rather than narrow, the picture. Unreal really did go through a tortured development process, didn't it?

Of course, ideas and words are one thing and delivery is another. A lot of what we actually ended up with that can be recognised in that document (e.g. Foundry, Toxic, Terranius) seems like a pretty timid interpretation of the original concept.
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 07:57

I might as well add that Unreal had "no visibility paths", where the engine supports leading a monster to a path that can have visibility where the player/enemy last was. It wasn't implemented because I guess it wasn't coded properly or finished, but Dots finished it and it's going to be in 227i. The interesting thing is it's all precalculated like normal paths, and not much work was really done to get it working again.

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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 09:19

Hellscrag wrote:Unreal really did go through a tortured development process, didn't it?

That could be for good. Looks like leaked design docs reveal too many ideas to gather in one world. That'll be too messy. Apparently, docs describe each idea that came to the mind of many developers. There'll be no place for so many species/races on a single planet, and on the other hand, paying a little attention to each one like Unreal II did will make game world... inconsistent, maybe. It is better to concentrate on single Nali/Skaarj idea rather than trying to bring as much variety to game as possible. Again, Unreal II did it, seemingly implementing ideas from these leaks, and I think that made it not so immersive and compelling - you just travel from one planet to another, killing different species on each one.
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 09:35

What the heck is Dissent? I'm guessing yet another lost level of awesome (such as morose, soledad, etc) to be found and restored?
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 09:40

Dissent is another decayed-themed level. Except it was made by Myscha and it was about Skaarj, Bio Rifles and goop. It was shown in the U97 xmas trailer so it exists. Recovering it is another story...
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 09:57

Just read Unreal_Story_So_Far.rtf

Wow, that right there legitimises sooo many packs I've played over the years. Those nali rebels in ONP and skytown redux aren't all that farfetched after all. And finally I understand why Deja vu is called "Gryphon revisited". Cool stuff
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 13:52

TheIronKnuckle wrote:Just read Unreal_Story_So_Far.rtf

Wow, that right there legitimises sooo many packs I've played over the years. Those nali rebels in ONP and skytown redux aren't all that farfetched after all. And finally I understand why Deja vu is called "Gryphon revisited". Cool stuff


I argued for years that the Nali planet should be called "Gryphon" and not "Na Pali", if it were to be named at all, but nobody listened to me :P. To me, the naming of RTNP only legitimised a mistake. It always seemed clear to me, playing through the original game, that "Na Pali" was the name of a town and not the whole darned planet.

I gave up on that argument some time between the development of the first version of Deja Vu and the announcement of Battle for Na Pali.
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 14:05

I thought it was Na Pali for Nali and Gryphon for humans.
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 14:45

UBerserker wrote:I thought it was Na Pali for Nali and Gryphon for humans.


I think that was one theory put forward to try to resolve the conflict.

I've since accepted "Na Pali" as the de facto name of the planet... but in the original game, I don't think there can be any mistake as to what is meant by "Gateway to Na Pali" and "Na Pali Haven". :)
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 17:39

Quickly browsed through the document yesterday.
Some interesting stuff in there, there's quite a bit of background detail that appears like they had some ideas quite early on (terraniux, foundry) though i have to say some of the stuff takes away the mysteriousness the game has (and supposedly thats the reason why most of these details arent present in the game, or replaced by others)

interestingly, no mention of any of the nali gods, vandora, chizra, dasa(?) didn't seem to exist in this document. plus, velora does not remind me of a nali fortress at all.

Another interesting thing is... there's a mention of a starship themed spaceship using a steampunk-ish theme, this answers the questions i had about starship.utx years ago, which seems to have some really odd out of place textures for a starship (the retro 50's aperture doors, bolted panels and windows)

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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 17:56

Turboman wrote:plus, velora does not remind me of a nali fortress at all.


?
Pretty sure it refers to a never-released Myscha map.
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User avatar Hellscrag
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 21:22

"Velora" does indeed appear to refer to an unreleased fortress. I think it finally explains why Velora Pass is called "VeloraEnd". I guess the cellars in the beta are all we have left of it.

UB, it's clear that several of Myscha's concepts here were later given to other mappers such as Inoxx to work on. I'd imagine that Velora was probably given to Jeremy War, as he was the mapper for VeloraEnd including the cellars.
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 21:31

The gap between Cryox (which was supposed to be even much larger like the Mothership) Velora Cellars should be Triton and Velora since they're both "original" Nali structures, and Triton itself is found in an underwater lake or something which would really fit the ending of Cryox.
Lots of occasions to use Underwrld.umx

Also lol at those Starship textures. I completely forgot about the submarine-like theme.
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 21:42

I suppose the castle referred to in the UNBIBLE for Main Map 1 could be Rrajigar Castle? Myscha's "the story so far" seems to confirm the novel "Prophet's Power" as actually being part of the backstory of the game (at one stage, anyway). I remember a lot of mention being made of a castle called Rrajigar in the books.

And, if so, do the three original palaces of Nali civilisation then become Rrajigar, Triton and Velora?

So many questions and inconsistencies... somebody should try to make a definitive account of Unreal places and lore and the evolution of map concepts (to the greatest extent possible) from what is now available. A few years ago I might have had a go myself but, alas, I have other priorities these days!
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Subject: Re: The UNBIBLE

Post Posted: 22 Dec 2011, 22:29

Hellscrag wrote:
TheIronKnuckle wrote:Just read Unreal_Story_So_Far.rtf

Wow, that right there legitimises sooo many packs I've played over the years. Those nali rebels in ONP and skytown redux aren't all that farfetched after all. And finally I understand why Deja vu is called "Gryphon revisited". Cool stuff


I argued for years that the Nali planet should be called "Gryphon" and not "Na Pali", if it were to be named at all, but nobody listened to me :P. To me, the naming of RTNP only legitimised a mistake. It always seemed clear to me, playing through the original game, that "Na Pali" was the name of a town and not the whole darned planet.

I gave up on that argument some time between the development of the first version of Deja Vu and the announcement of Battle for Na Pali.


But how did you know it was gryphon? Where in the game itself was there any mention of the planet being named "Gryphon"?
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