Hardest stock Unreal map?

[Hellscrag]

So, after one of my long gaps I've gone back for another run-through of the original Unreal campaign. I'm currently half way through. In order to increase the jeopardy, I'm playing with the rule that I don't save the game except at the start of a map - with certain rare exceptions.

This leads me to ask the question, which do you think are the hardest stock Unreal maps to complete in this way, and why? Here's my shortlist - I'm not including RtNP because I think "Inside UMS Prometheus" would beat everything else by a country mile.

Terraniux - Because the damage a Mercenary or Slith can do is considerable if you make a mistake

Temple of Vandora - Because of the Titan fight right at the end

The SunSpire - Because of the scarcity of armour and the prevalence of Skaarj with Eightballs, often with a height advantage, right up until the end

MotherShip Core - Because of the general intensity of it all


Out of these, I think The SunSpire may just edge it, partly because it's so long! What do you think?

[UB_]

There's no real "hardest" map in Unreal because half of the deaths are caused by mistakes like dodging out of the Sunspire walkways because monster X just spawned all of a sudden somewhere without a proper explanation. The best I can do is using tiers, you can never go wrong with those.
p.s. Terraniux wins.

Hardest levels by your rule

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Rank S = Terraniux, The Sunspire, Mothership Lab, Mothership Core

Rank A = ISV Kran Decks 3&2, ISV Kran Deck 1, Cellars at Dasa Pass, The Darkening

Rank B = Rrajigar Mine, Chizra Nali Water God, Dark Arena, ISV Kran Deck 4, Outpost 3J, Bluff Eversmoking, Serpent Canyon

Rank C = Depths of Rrajigar, The Ceremonial Chambers, Temple of Vandora, Dasa Mountain Pass, Nali Castle, Demon Crater, Skaarj Generator

Rank D = Nyleve's Falls, Noork's Elbow, The Trench, Spire Village, Gateway to Na Pali, Na Pali Haven, Velora Pass, Demonlord's Lair, The Source

Rank E = Sacred Passage, Harobed Village, Terraniux Underground, Mothership Basement, The Source Antechamber 

Rank F = Vortex Rikers, Illumination


The biggest "bullshit" prize may probably go to Mothership Lab with that Skaarj Gunner found right after one of the portals. Terraniux is there since the Mercenaries are all boosted. Sunspire is just long and has spawning monsters. Anything with sudden spawnings make things harder, like that Skaarj who sometimes appears in Chizra.

If I had to put the RTNP levels too

Code: Select all

Rank S = Terraniux, The Sunspire, Mothership Lab, Mothership Core, Inside UMS Prometheus

Rank A = ISV Kran Decks 3&2, ISV Kran Deck 1, Cellars at Dasa Pass, The Darkening, Spire Valley, Foundry Tarydium Plant, Gala's Peak

Rank B = Rrajigar Mine, Chizra Nali Water God, Dark Arena, ISV Kran Deck 4, Outpost 3J, Bluff Eversmoking, Serpent Canyon, Glathriel Village 2, UMS Prometheus, Velora Temple, Gala's Peak, Escape from Na Pali

Rank C = Depths of Rrajigar, The Ceremonial Chambers, Temple of Vandora, Dasa Mountain Pass, Nali Castle, Demon Crater, Skaarj Generator, Edge of Na Pali, Nagomi Passage

Rank D = Nyleve's Falls, Noork's Elbow, The Trench, Spire Village, Gateway to Na Pali, Na Pali Haven, Velora Pass, Demonlord's Lair, The Source, Neve's Crossing, Eldora Well, Nagomi Passage Dawn, Watcher of the Skies

Rank E = Sacred Passage, Harobed Village, Terraniux Underground, Mothership Basement, The Source Antechamber, Glathriel Village 1, Approaching UMS Prometheus 

Rank F = Vortex Rikers, Illumination


[integration]

Well, this may depend, on which difficulty you play, if it's your first time walkthrough and which rules, you use. I refuse to use the invisibility and every enemy, who wants to fight, will get its fight. IMHO the hardest section are the mothership maps prior to Skaarj generator. Without armor, Skaarj troopers can kill you with one hit (eightball, flakshell, razorblade headshot).

Mothership basement: how I hate those lasers
Demon Crater: hardest combats, though easy with invisiblity (turn on light before first battle, avoid battle in the ship's inner circle)
Mothership Core: OMG so many troopers

Judging from where I die, Sunspire, ISV-Kran, Chizra, Temple of Vandora and Dasa Pass Cellars are also hard sections. Though, I find Terraniux rather easy.

[UB_]

Just pass under the lasers when they do a regular wave pattern. Terraniux is a gamble with Mercenaries that spawn and that never die + Invulnerability shield, making them the strongest enemies in the whole games (and they are annoying enough).

Vandora is the easiest of the dungeons, I don't think I have ever died in there.

[Gizzy]

Sunspire wins it here for me. fuck coop servers that don't have checkpoints set up so I have to walk ALL_THE_WAY round to the front door again >:(

[Frieza]

I think Ill go with Cellars at Dasa Pass purely for its length, amount of mobs and the close quarters titan fight

[Hellscrag]

Interesting to see your answers. Length alone isn't usually a problem for me because there's generally so much health about, and nor are mobs of Krall because they aren't that hard to beat. I'm much more likely to get iced as a result of making a mistake during a single combat with a more powerful enemy such as a Skaarj Gunner (or a Titan), even if I enter that combat with high health, which is why I find the SunSpire difficult and Bluff Eversmoking and Cellars at Dasa Pass, whose Titan fight appears at the beginning and is avoidable anyway, pretty easy! ISV-Kran isn't that much of a problem for me either, that is if you don't try to kill all the Skaarj at the start of Deck 1.

I'd say it's a combination of length and tough individual combats that makes it hard for me when playing by a "no saving" rule.

[Frieza]

I'm just guestimating here, you kinda inspired me to try one of those no saving playthroughs as well, Ill report back with my findings

Are you playing on Unreal difficulty?

[UB_]

My lists take in consideration Unreal difficulty

[Hellscrag]

Yes, Unreal difficulty. Lol, glad to be a source of inspiration... Good luck!

(I saved before the Titan in Temple of Vandora because I knew I would probably die a couple of times, which I did...)

My thoughts on the SunSpire by the way are predicated on an assumption that you try to visit most areas... I know it's possible to shortcut the majority of it if you know your way around (which I do).

[UB_]

The Sunspire is long and has several Skaarj Troopers around. You can take an easy route and do fine, so it may not be the most difficult of them all.
For Vandora's Titan descend diagonally in the lowest levels of the arena then quickly return on the highest floor. Shoot Eightball grenades in the meantime.

[TheIronKnuckle]

I did a "no saving" run through once on unreal difficulty. It originally started out as a simple way of testing my laptops graphics card, and I assumed I'd get owned round about chizra and be able to move on with life. I ended up managing to get all the way up to the middle decks of kran before deciding to stop wasting time and go be productive in the real world.

Must admit, it was very fun Will revisit the challenge some day.

[Shivaxi]

I'll reference my opinion based on the first time I played Unreal. I have to say, Sunspire does take a big chunk of the cake...skaarj and krall at every corner in a huge labyrinth of a map...I dont even remember how long it took me to get through Sunspire...I was constantly getting turned around lol. Once you figure out the shortest path though, I can run through this map fairly quickly.

Bluff was like that too...bit of a maze map where I wasnt sure where to go...but Bluff wasnt exactly hard as it was just difficult to figure out. Again though, after you figure out the correct path and order of things, it becomes simple. But the map that definitely %100 of the cake for me is...

Terraniux

!@#$ this map so hard...i swear to god...i STILL get lost in this bloody map and I've probably played it a thousand times over. I don't know what it is about this map but I still seem to get lost somehow...not to mention as many others have stated that it's full of the most annoying and hardest creatures in the Unreal universe. Mercenaries (especially your first time fighting them) are a b!@#h and i think everyone will agree. Stock Unreal weapons just don't do them justice. I dont know how many times i died my first time through or how long I got stuck running in circles on this map...probably more than i care to admit.

So yeah...there's my 2 cents =P

[[]KAOS[]Casey]

I've played all these maps countless times over the years in coop and I don't really recall any being particularly hard after 3 years of spamming{before people made crap mods that lowered the difficulty to about 0}, but if I had to say any..

Terraniux just because mercenaries.

Mothership lab because of those bullshit movers that kill you because your fps/server tickrate is too high/low.

I don't get why you guys keep saying the sunspire because you really only need to fight a few monsters. most of the time spent in that map is going up elevators and waiting on the thing to get to skycaves.

[Levelworm]

I have just finished playing Unreal on Hard difficulty, with lots of save and load though.

I'd say that ISV Kran Decks 3 and the Sunspire are the most difficulty ones.

ISV Kran Decks 3: I didn't know that the Skaaj warriors respawn, so I wasted lots of eightballs and flak ammo on them before I realized that I have to push the three buttons quickly and get into the engine room. The rest of the fight was difficult as I had to rely on ASMD and razors, worse is that I had no armor and there wasn't much health in that level. Finally I decided to replay from the beginning and it was piece of a cake.

The Sunspire: Same story, I used up eightballs and most of the flak ammo to dispense the three titans, so I have to deal with the Skraaj troopers with razors and ASMD and Stinger, not very effective against their eightballs I must say. The worst is the combination of Pupae and darkness. I'd say that this is probably the most difficult level.

I didn't find the final levels to be difficult, as I had much better protection and firepower then and the curved corridors were very good for bouncing razors. Actually I found the combat in those levels were entertaining and replayed for once.

BTW can anyone teach me how to run RTNP in UT+Oldskool? I did some searches but could not find any viable solution. I'd like to play RTNP in Unreal Gold but it had certain graphic glitches. Maybe I'll try the unofficial patch as well as the openGL patch.