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HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

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UB_
Nali Priest Nali Priest
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Subject: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 30 Dec 2014, 00:42

After 15 years since Unreal is released and something undocumented comes out of the blue.

http://forums.beyondunreal.com/showthread.php?t=203080

Leo(T.C.K.) wrote:The HUB system worked in Unreal all ALONG! I noticed this while browsing log/comments that around march 1998 this was implemented. The mysterious ?peer at the end of a level teleporter forces the linear transition.
But there were two other... ?push and ?pop
?pop on itself can restart the hub, but when used together in a hub it works miracles. As I couldn't test this myself UB did all the practic research trying this out in a game.
He used the zora's beta conversion maps since they are largely unaltered and dont use custom scripts for hubs. fhub4 has been used as showcase. I'll summon UB shortly..

EDIT: we did some testing with zeurkous on his machine ourselves because his curiosity won over him and he ran unreal after a long time. If all three ?push ?peer and ?pop are used it works well. There can be multiple pushes but not multiple pops. the saves game#.usa are kept until loadgame occurs or ?load= simply.



Myself/UBerserker wrote:I tested this on UT. It works on 227 only if you turn off pawn and decoration shadows, otherwise it crashes when "pushing" (tested by jetv435, thanks!).

http://www.mediafire.com/download/qxht2 ... esting.zip
http://www.mediafire.com/download/q0bs3 ... etaStuff.u
Hopefully I've put there all necessary files.

I have used FHub4 & Soledad and FHub5 & Nexus+NexusEnd & Aztec as showcases. The feature itself works perfectly but there seems to be limitations. Loading in the "hub" map deletes the Game#.usa file that contains the map's status as you've left it; technically it doesn't matter but if you load the game in FHub4 once and then load in Soledad - now Soledad's teleport won't work because the game#.usa file is deleted.
I suppose this won't likely work in Coop, sadly. However this just came out so we have all the time to experiment with the system.


Well, fuck.
Last edited by UB_ on 26 Jan 2015, 18:41, edited 2 times in total.
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User avatar Sat42
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 30 Dec 2014, 12:45

I have to say some Unrealists are amazingly dedicated!! To unearth this after so long bears testimony to that :P

It's kinda ironic too, given that, without the knowledge of the existing Unreal HUB system, some had to go the extra mile in order to achieve the same type of result (Legacy...).
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 30 Dec 2014, 17:55

That's really interesting. Any idea if it was kept in the later Unreal series titles, like Unreal 2 and UT2004?

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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 30 Dec 2014, 19:02

Did Legacy for UT99 use this mysterious left over system or did oldsk00l implement it's own hub system?
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UB_
Nali Priest Nali Priest
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 30 Dec 2014, 19:29

No idea if UE2 still has it but I have no way to test it currently.
As for Legacy, it used custom scripts but I never looked at its system - I need to check it out.
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User avatar Mister_Prophet
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 30 Dec 2014, 21:21

As far as I'm aware Legacy used its own system, but I also admit I never looked.

I've tried to get this idea off the ground as well, a couple of times. The way I saw it was that we had to know what kind of stuff gets saved, what doesn't, and we have to make a conscious decision to drop COOP support. I always favored a HUB system where exact player actions are saved when levels are reentered, as if you are loading a save file. It seems it's harder to do this than simply backtracking a map through teleportation points where level events reset. The fact that they thought of this is quite cool, even with the limitations.

Cool discovery, regardless. Reminds me when it was discovered that the Macro function in texture properties worked and mappers could apply animated alphas to walls. All of this built into the game and not noticed for years because it was unused by Epic.

UB_
Nali Priest Nali Priest
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 30 Dec 2014, 21:57

HUB system saves literally everything that was on the level (including spawned stuff and even custom pawns like the Demon Skaarj) except decals.
Also I believe the save system works better outside of Oldskool but I'm leaving other people to test this too. I'm sure oldskool is causing the deletion of game0.usa when loading the game in the Hub map.
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User avatar Shivaxi
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 08 Jan 2015, 05:01

Not to sound like a downer but...I thought we knew this already? Didn't .:..: use this method when he converted the beta maps to standard Unreal version? Since it worked in the beta I thought. I'm just curious.
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UB_
Nali Priest Nali Priest
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 08 Jan 2015, 09:07

It didn't for me at all from what I remember. Besides where are now both conversions to download?
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 08 Jan 2015, 15:32

The Unreal Beta itself is on Hyper's site. I thought the converted maps were too but I can't seem to find them there.

edit: Looks like gamefront has them. Also looks like Zora converted the maps too, didn't know that.

http://www.gamefront.com/files/4456863/zoraunreal97_zip
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UB_
Nali Priest Nali Priest
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 08 Jan 2015, 16:13

Zora's conversion was (and is) the one I have always used because there weren't any changes aside from technical bugs caused by the conversion.
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User avatar Shivaxi
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 09 Jan 2015, 02:10

UBerserker wrote:Zora's conversion was (and is) the one I have always used because there weren't any changes aside from technical bugs caused by the conversion.


Wait, so did Zora's version use the hub system? I mean the original beta maps had the 6 or so hub maps, so how are they done in zora's version?
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Waffnuffly: If there is any purpose for the god damned ocean, it is for us to eat it.
Jet_v4.3.5: I want to be Lincoln and kick Satan's ass. Emancipate and Proclimate on his ass.

UB_
Nali Priest Nali Priest
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 09 Jan 2015, 14:27

Shivaxi wrote:
UBerserker wrote:Zora's conversion was (and is) the one I have always used because there weren't any changes aside from technical bugs caused by the conversion.


Wait, so did Zora's version use the hub system? I mean the original beta maps had the 6 or so hub maps, so how are they done in zora's version?


There's no Hub system in Zora conversion. Nothing gets saved like in the dots' one. Basically how it worked in the original beta game.

I applied the ?pop and ?push things in the demonstration maps (which are the ones from the Zora's conversion) and that's about it.
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 23 Jan 2015, 00:10

Could you reupload the hub testing maps, please? The download link seems to be dead.
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UB_
Nali Priest Nali Priest
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Subject: Re: HUB system in Unreal exists and works!

Post Posted: 23 Jan 2015, 00:20

Try now, the quote somehow screwed up the link.
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